Bobnearled = Bobinder

[bobinder]

Yes, I've said before how much I love that first picture, the group of women each so different yet with a common purpose. The casual look to the guards, the practical clothing, the different characters coming through. I would love to see more in this series but I know that unlike 3d art each pic is a separate work and it can be hard to get the models right in more than one frame. It is a picture that inspires the imagination.

Like this study that you posted recently, Bob. I look forward to seeing where it finishes up
View attachment 381853

Thanks. There are a number of pictures under development currently but the end results will be generally predictable! Please carry on introducing my new stuff in your New Finds thread - I'm mostly examining older work here at the moment.

 

[bobinder]

I have read that loincloths were used in Judea to cater to the sensibilities of the Jews who objected to people hanging in public totally naked. I think this is unlikely, given that the source of that idea is a Christian publication, and likely biased, and given the fact that the Romans stripped people for crucifixion precisely because it offended standards of modesty. I think it much more likely that the church prescribed loincloths to retrofit its own standard of modesty.

Since Christianity became the official Roman religion, the early church tended to take a pro-Roman view, playing down certain historical excesses and shifting blame for the Jesus crucifixion onto the Jews. The church apologists were keen to show the Romans in the best possible light, even attributing standards of decency which are historically questionable.

 

[Barbaria1]

Since Christianity became the official Roman religion, the early church tended to take a pro-Roman view, playing down certain historical excesses and shifting blame for the Jesus crucifixion onto the Jews. The church apologists were keen to show the Romans in the best possible light, even attributing standards of decency which are historically questionable.

Rather opportunistic then, weren't they? ... the start of a long history of apologists finding scapegoats for inconvenient facts, as well as novel ways to buttress their control over the faithful.

 

[bobinder]

I simply find it amazing how you create your art Bobinder, using a mouse as a brush. I bet it is time consuming, and I thank you for taking the time to produce such great work. This first image is very interesting, it allows my imagination to run wild with possible storylines. I like the way the other women are leading the condemmed woman, some of them seem to be overly excited, and they should be

Thanks. Even though I now have Photoshop, I still finish pictures in Paint so that I can make very precise adjustments and refinements. It's a technique I have become used to, and whilst it is time-consuming it is good to know how much the results are appreciated.

 

[bobinder]

Rather opportunistic then, weren't they? ... the start of a long history of apologists finding scapegoats for inconvenient facts, as well as novel ways to buttress their control over the faithful.

Indeed, to say nothing of the reduction of women to the status of second class citizens - consider the number of pre-Christian religions with priestesses and Goddesses!

 

[Barbaria1]

Indeed, to say nothing of the reduction of women to the status of second class citizens - consider the number of pre-Christian religions with priestesses and Goddesses!

And, weren't there sects or groups in very early Christianity, primarily in the east, that included women at the top?

 

[bobinder]

Crux Fashion 4

The accompanying 'Crux Fashion' illustration implies a reaction against the brilliant, bleached white loin cloths of Renaissance altarpieces. Most of my girls wouldn't be seen dead in a loin cloth but that doesn't mean it's not going to happen! They won't be appearing at church altars and don't need to look their best. If such a concession was permitted, the loin cloth of a person about to suffer a spectacularly revolting death, and not bothering to make a good impression with it, might be a cheap old rag, perhaps of undyed linen, eminently disposable but equally as reusable as the woodwork bearing its silent testimony of old blood stains and nail holes. The last picture shows the distressing effect of numerous crucifixions on one of those Renaissance altarpiece tennis whites, which should be sufficient to get you barred from your local club. The only thing of value here is a person's life and that's shortly to depreciate. Close study of my 'Ivdaea Capta' pictures will reveal how tituli and loin cloths tend to disappear from the crucifix, presumably stolen as trophies by ghoulish souvenir hunters. It might be a cheap method of execution but it was worth every denarius in deterrent value (actually it wasn't because the victims just kept coming...)

#1 (Irina) and #2 (Iohanna) are both modelling fairly minimalist one-or-two-piece loin cloths, tied above the left hip. These were both drawn onto the figures directly in Windows Paint, following much speculation on my part, and are basically imaginative. The version at #4 (Iohanna) was in response to a request for a red velvet loin cloth - an incongruously luxurious item in which to humiliate the wearer, and one which I expected to reduce the visual impact of the blood. Out of curiosity I performed the colour change in Openoffice Draw and transferred it to the figure.

Back on the catwalk, #3 (Capella/Gabriella, but better known as Femjoy's Kylie A) is modelling a strip of wool fabric torn from the stolen Legionary's cloak she was caught wearing, hence the unusual colour for crucifix apparel. Zoom in and check out the fabric weave on this! (zoom in on the full picture in the previous post - it's twice the size so you'll see the individual threads!) In a moment of inspiration I realised that I could photograph a piece of fabric draped approximately to the model pose and manipulate it onto the figure. By the time I did this one I had Photoshop, mercifully!

For #5 (Iasmina) I wound a seven-foot strip of cloth twice round a tailor's dummy, knotted it on one side and photographed it. It then went through Openoffice Draw for colour changing and several skews and distorts in Photoshop before I got it to fit the figure. In the end I worked it over in Paint to make it look more creased and distressed but so far it is my most successful attempt at natural undyed linen (why don't I just go and buy some natural undyed linen...?)

 

[bobinder]

I'm sure she feels suitably honoured. "Gaby, you're going to be crucified wearing a Roman soldier's cloak! How cool is that!?"

Or perhaps she regretted ever accepting the gift of the cloak from the rebel boyfriend in the first place? Either way, it was the property of the Legion and was most likely taken from a dead Roman - it makes her guilty by association. At least she got to keep part of it for a while...

 

[Cella]

Crux Fashion 4

The accompanying 'Crux Fashion' illustration implies a reaction against the brilliant, bleached white loin cloths of Renaissance altarpieces. Most of my girls wouldn't be seen dead in a loin cloth but that doesn't mean it's not going to happen! They won't be appearing at church altars and don't need to look their best. If such a concession was permitted, the loin cloth of a person about to suffer a spectacularly revolting death, and not bothering to make a good impression with it, might be a cheap old rag, perhaps of undyed linen, eminently disposable but equally as reusable as the woodwork bearing its silent testimony of old blood stains and nail holes. The last picture shows the distressing effect of numerous crucifixions on one of those Renaissance altarpiece tennis whites, which should be sufficient to get you barred from your local club. The only thing of value here is a person's life and that's shortly to depreciate. Close study of my 'Ivdaea Capta' pictures will reveal how tituli and loin cloths tend to disappear from the crucifix, presumably stolen as trophies by ghoulish souvenir hunters. It might be a cheap method of execution but it was worth every denarius in deterrent value (actually it wasn't because the victims just kept coming...)

#1 (Irina) and #2 (Iohanna) are both modelling fairly minimalist one-or-two-piece loin cloths, tied above the left hip. These were both drawn onto the figures directly in Windows Paint, following much speculation on my part, and are basically imaginative. The version at #4 (Iohanna) was in response to a request for a red velvet loin cloth - an incongruously luxurious item in which to humiliate the wearer, and one which I expected to reduce the visual impact of the blood. Out of curiosity I performed the colour change in Openoffice Draw and transferred it to the figure.

Back on the catwalk, #3 (Capella/Gabriella, but better known as Femjoy's Kylie A) is modelling a strip of wool fabric torn from the stolen Legionary's cloak she was caught wearing, hence the unusual colour for crucifix apparel. Zoom in and check out the fabric weave on this! (zoom in on the full picture in the previous post - it's twice the size so you'll see the individual threads!) In a moment of inspiration I realised that I could photograph a piece of fabric draped approximately to the model pose and manipulate it onto the figure. By the time I did this one I had Photoshop, mercifully!

For #5 (Iasmina) I wound a seven-foot strip of cloth twice round a tailor's dummy, knotted it on one side and photographed it. It then went through Openoffice Draw for colour changing and several skews and distorts in Photoshop before I got it to fit the figure. In the end I worked it over in Paint to make it look more creased and distressed but so far it is my most successful attempt at natural undyed linen (why don't I just go and buy some natural undyed linen...?)

Your descriptions of loincloth fashions makes it sound like these girls are parading down a modeling runway!

"And now, showing us the latest in spring crux loincloths, comes Giselle, wearing this flirty little number by Ralph Lauren. Just perfect for these warmer days when you want to show as much skin as possible . . . yet remain teasing as you hang. Just lovely."

I love your unique style. You show the stress, strain and pain of crucifixion very realistically.

 

[Barbaria1]

I'd like to be crucified in the cute tie-above-the-left-hip loincloth... I like the cut. It shows off my legs and midriff nicely and affords me just the right amount of modesty where it counts.

 

[bobinder]

And, weren't there sects or groups in very early Christianity, primarily in the east, that included women at the top?

Well, there is the cult of the Black Madonna, although that's mostly about revering Mary Magdalen. I think it has links to the Cathars and was prevalent in southern France, where the Magdalen supposedly travelled. One of the Popes allegedly turned out to be a female, but I'm not otherwise aware of females being ordained in early church sects. Certainly there have always been disparate sects but the predominent early one relied heavily on St. Paul, who was, not surprisingly, a Roman citizen... Priestesses in the early Christian church represent an area of ignorance which I need to address. Thanks, B

 

[bobinder]

Your descriptions of loincloth fashions makes it sound like these girls are parading down a modeling runway!

"And now, showing us the latest in spring crux loincloths, comes Giselle, wearing this flirty little number by Ralph Lauren. Just perfect for these warmer days when you want to show as much skin as possible . . . yet remain teasing as you hang. Just lovely."

I love your unique style. You show the stress, strain and pain of crucifixion very realistically.

Thanks. I did wonder if the first picture looked a bit like one of those mail order catalogues!

 

[Barbaria1]

Well, there is the cult of the Black Madonna, although that's mostly about revering Mary Magdalen. I think it has links to the Cathars and was prevalent in southern France, where the Magdalen supposedly travelled. One of the Popes allegedly turned out to be a female, but I'm not otherwise aware of females being ordained in early church sects. Certainly there have always been disparate sects but the predominent early one relied heavily on St. Paul, who was, not surprisingly, a Roman citizen... Priestesses in the early Christian church represent an area of ignorance which I need to address. Thanks, B

I wish I could remember where I read this. Isn't there also something about one of the gospels that never were accepted into the canon having a view on the role of women that the church authorities in Rome wanted repressed?

 

[bobinder]

I wish I could remember where I read this. Isn't there also something about one of the gospels that never were accepted into the canon having a view on the role of women that the church authorities in Rome wanted repressed?

The Patricia Arquette/Gabriel Byrne film 'Stigmata' details the Vatican's supression of the Gospel of Thomas, but there were numerous early gospels which didn't make it into the New Testament. I think there is supposed to be one by Mary Magdalen somewhere. Basically, Constantine instructed the Bishops at the Council of Nicea to resolve amongst themselves which gospels would be officially recognised for the New Testament. The Bishops selected the ones which didn't place women in important roles (although they seem to have inadvertently included Mary Magdalen as the first witness to the Resurrection). Constantine continued as an adherent of Sol Invictus, not converting to Christianity until his death bed, although his mother, Empress Helena, was an active Christian. She is probably best known for her pioneering archaeological excavations in the holy land, during which she achieved the remarkable feat of finding the three crosses from Golgotha buried in a cistern, and identifying the 'True Cross', which was subsequently reduced to splinters for distribution to numerous reliquaries. It has, however, been suggested that there are sufficient fragments of the true cross to construct a forest... I digress - I'm not an expert on them, but check out apocryphal gospels for the ones which didn't make it.

 

[Barbaria1]

The Patricia Arquette/Gabriel Byrne film 'Stigmata' details the Vatican's supression of the Gospel of Thomas, but there were numerous early gospels which didn't make it into the New Testament. I think there is supposed to be one by Mary Magdalen somewhere. Basically, Constantine instructed the Bishops at the Council of Nicea to resolve amongst themselves which gospels would be officially recognised for the New Testament. The Bishops selected the ones which didn't place women in important roles (although they seem to have inadvertently included Mary Magdalen as the first witness to the Resurrection). Constantine continued as an adherent of Sol Invictus, not converting to Christianity until his death bed, although his mother, Empress Helena, was an active Christian. She is probably best known for her pioneering archaeological excavations in the holy land, during which she achieved the remarkable feat of finding the three crosses from Golgotha buried in a cistern, and identifying the 'True Cross', which was subsequently reduced to splinters for distribution to numerous reliquaries. It has, however, been suggested that there are sufficient fragments of the true cross to construct a forest... I digress - I'm not an expert on them, but check out apocryphal gospels for the ones which didn't make it.

Oops on Mary Magdalene

Reliquaries are another wonderful example of the Church's unending need to dazzle its followers and loosen the strings of their purses ... Pieces of the true cross, pieces of Mary's cloak, earth from Golgotha, a vial of the Ssviour's blood ... The list goes on and on.

 

[bobinder]

Oops on Mary Magdalene

Reliquaries are another wonderful example of the Church's unending need to dazzle its followers and loosen the strings of their purses ... Pieces of the true cross, pieces of Mary's cloak, earth from Golgotha, a vial of the Ssviour's blood ... The list goes on and on.

Absolutely - just about everything imaginable was produced (or even duplicated!) as a relic somewhere. I wish I could remember the source, but one religious establishment even claimed to have the loin cloth worn by Jesus during crucifixion (as if there should be any doubt about its existence in the first place!)

 

[Barbaria1]

Absolutely - just about everything imaginable was produced (or even duplicated!) as a relic somewhere. I wish I could remember the source, but one religious establishment even claimed to have the loin cloth worn by Jesus during crucifixion (as if there should be any doubt about its existence in the first place!)

Nice cover up job there

Bruges is the proud possessor of the vial of the Holy Blood, brought back from the Crusades and which miraculously can liquify!

 

[thehangingtree]

There is a Black Madonna Shine a hill away from the Tree Estate (really)...
http://www.franciscancaring.org/blackmadonnashri.html

I'd like to be crucified in the cute tie-above-the-left-hip loincloth... I like the cut. It shows off my legs and midriff nicely and affords me just the right amount of modesty where it counts.

You'll be lucky to get an unwashed piece of coarse burlap...

Crux Fashion 4

The accompanying 'Crux Fashion' illustration implies a reaction against the brilliant, bleached white loin cloths of Renaissance altarpieces. Most of my girls wouldn't be seen dead in a loin cloth but that doesn't mean it's not going to happen! They won't be appearing at church altars and don't need to look their best. If such a concession was permitted, the loin cloth of a person about to suffer a spectacularly revolting death, and not bothering to make a good impression with it, might be a cheap old rag, perhaps of undyed linen, eminently disposable but equally as reusable as the woodwork bearing its silent testimony of old blood stains and nail holes. The last picture shows the distressing effect of numerous crucifixions on one of those Renaissance altarpiece tennis whites, which should be sufficient to get you barred from your local club. The only thing of value here is a person's life and that's shortly to depreciate. Close study of my 'Ivdaea Capta' pictures will reveal how tituli and loin cloths tend to disappear from the crucifix, presumably stolen as trophies by ghoulish souvenir hunters. It might be a cheap method of execution but it was worth every denarius in deterrent value (actually it wasn't because the victims just kept coming...)

#1 (Irina) and #2 (Iohanna) are both modelling fairly minimalist one-or-two-piece loin cloths, tied above the left hip. These were both drawn onto the figures directly in Windows Paint, following much speculation on my part, and are basically imaginative. The version at #4 (Iohanna) was in response to a request for a red velvet loin cloth - an incongruously luxurious item in which to humiliate the wearer, and one which I expected to reduce the visual impact of the blood. Out of curiosity I performed the colour change in Openoffice Draw and transferred it to the figure.

Back on the catwalk, #3 (Capella/Gabriella, but better known as Femjoy's Kylie A) is modelling a strip of wool fabric torn from the stolen Legionary's cloak she was caught wearing, hence the unusual colour for crucifix apparel. Zoom in and check out the fabric weave on this! (zoom in on the full picture in the previous post - it's twice the size so you'll see the individual threads!) In a moment of inspiration I realised that I could photograph a piece of fabric draped approximately to the model pose and manipulate it onto the figure. By the time I did this one I had Photoshop, mercifully!

For #5 (Iasmina) I wound a seven-foot strip of cloth twice round a tailor's dummy, knotted it on one side and photographed it. It then went through Openoffice Draw for colour changing and several skews and distorts in Photoshop before I got it to fit the figure. In the end I worked it over in Paint to make it look more creased and distressed but so far it is my most successful attempt at natural undyed linen (why don't I just go and buy some natural undyed linen...?)

Very well done...

 

[Eulalia]

Perhaps the weirdest of all

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Prepuce

 

[thehangingtree]

Perhaps the weirdest of all

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Prepuce

ummm... Yep!!!!